Darshan of Swami Krishnananda in 1999

by Swami Krishnananda

11. Questions from a French Group

(Darshan given in February 1999)

Swamiji: The question is, daily you must do meditation, chanting Om for fifteen minutes. The chanting of Om is not necessary, but it helps you in creating the concentration, attention of the mind. The whole thing is, every day you must do it. The principal is to expand the consciousness of the individual to the wider circle of the whole world, and to the still-wider circle of the whole cosmos, and then to the still-wider circle of God Almighty Himself. Then this is something like Godman-thinking. This practice should be done every day.

You will be always happy if you do this meditation. The mind will not run here and there. As you say, it goes here, there. It will not go. It will go within the realm of God Himself. If the water of the ocean goes on moving, moving, it will be inside the ocean only. It cannot go outside. So even if the mind goes here and there, here and there, it is inside the Supreme Being, God Himself. You are moving in God, in the universe. Wherever you go, you will find the same thing. The distraction is due to the feeling that things are totally different from you, but they are not totally different. There is an organic connection with you.

It is very difficult to understand this because nobody thinks like this. Everyone thinks: “I am separate, I am coming from here, I have got this work, that work.” They are thinking only that. There is no harm in doing work. You can do every work but still connect it to the whole world. It is the world acting. All the work is done by the world itself. The world forces are operating through your fingers, hands, etc. If the world forces are not operating, you cannot do anything. You are wrongly thinking that you have got the strength to do work, but there is no such strength. It comes from the top, from the centre of the universe.

But we are foolish. We do not understand that. The ego is so strong that it attributes every success to its own self: “I am doing it. Let me do this. Let me go there.” These are all unnecessary talks. They are all effects produced by the order coming from the centre of the universe. That is the final truth, and continuously you must think this. Then the forces of nature will enter into you little by little, little by little, little by little. It may take years and years together. If the mind is strong enough, the peace of mind, as you say, will come much before the time you are expecting it; otherwise, if the mind is very weak but you are still intent on meditating like this, it will come one day or the other.

You should not have attachment. The main thing is that. You should not be attached to anything, because the world is one whole. To whom are you going to be attached? Are you attached to your hand and nose, and all that? It is yourself only, so when you are yourself there, why are you getting attached? People have attachment to everything in the world because they are wrongly thinking that everything is outside them. This is why the attachment comes, and that spoils everything.

A visitor: You have spoken about mind, but there is in my mind some confusion about what is mind.

Swamiji: The mind is a state of awareness, a state of consciousness being aware that there is something. Consciousness, when it thinks that there is something outside it, it is called the mind. But when consciousness feels that it is everywhere and there is nothing outside it, it is the super-mind, divine mind, God's mind. But when the mind thinks that there is something outside, that is the ordinary human mind. In the cosmic mind there is no object outside because everything is inside it only. My mind, your mind, everybody's mind is in one mind only. Everything is inside the One. The universe is one organic completeness.

Visitor: Every day I do one and a half hours of hatha yoga, and after this some pranayama, and after this some meditation. Do you think this is too much, one and a half hours hatha yoga every day?

Swamiji: If you have enough time to spare, do it. If you are free, you can do this. But if you are occupied with some job or some profession and you have no time, then you can reduce the time. More than one hour is not necessary. One hour is sufficient.

Another visitor: Do you have an idea of the evolution of Occidental thought, Occidental reflection, and where we are going in the Occident?

Swamiji: The Occident is going outward. It is not going inward, it is going outside. So it looks very comfortable, but it is not a solution.

Visitor: Do you mean the Occident goes outward in material things?

Swamiji: Are you thinking like an Occidental man just now?

Visitor: I suppose I think like everyone.

Swamiji: You see, we are here in India, and you are also living in your country. What is the difference between these two kinds of thinking?

Visitor: For me it is the same.

Swamiji: Then why are you calling it Occident? If everybody thinks in the same way, there is no difference between Occident and Orient. But it is not the same. There is a difference between the Oriental mind and the Occidental mind. The Occidental mind always thinks of outside. The Occidental mind wants more and more external comfort, and the Oriental mind is not like that. It tries to bring the outer into the inner. That is the only difference. The outer emphasis and interior emphasis – in that, the Orient and the Occident differ. The difference is, in the West, the sense organs are considered as the means of activity, and in India and the Orient, the mind is considered as superior, not the sense organs. The more you work through the sense organs you become exterior, and this is what is generally called Occident.

Another visitor: If I meditate in the morning, is it better for me than in the evening?

Swamiji: Which time is convenient to you, in the morning or in the evening?

Visitor: It is better in the evening.

Swamiji: Then do it in the evening when your work is over.

Another visitor: Which kind of meditation do you suggest as the best – Zen, for example, or what kind?

Swamiji: You see, in India we call meditation Dhyana. In Chinese it is called Chan, and in Japan it is called Zen. It is the same thing. The method is the same. There are many methods of meditation – on the breathing, on the structure of the mind, and then it goes finally to wider and wider circles of the whole creation. Just now I was mentioning to you to bring the whole world together into your meditational object. Finally, you meditate on God only, that's all.

Another visitor: Is it possible to find something which is in common, in union, between the Occidental and the Oriental?

Swamiji: When you consider the world as totally outside you, it is the Occidental method of thinking. When the world is considered as part of our existence itself and interiorised, that is the Oriental way of thinking. The world is not outside. We need not have to conquer it. We have only to become friendly with it. In Western countries there is a thought of conquering nature and mastering everything. There is no necessity to do that because the world is yourself only; therefore, if you master yourself, then you master the world also. That is more important than world control.

Visitor: In France, there are also swamis and so on who try to have a spiritual life, spiritual progress. If they live in the Occident, is it possible for them also to reach the same comprehension of world that you have here in India? Is it possible?

Swamiji: Now the East and the West are slowly coming together. The difference that was there many years back is going. Indians appreciate the West, and Westerners appreciate India. Slowly we are now coming to the point of world-thinking, not Occidental and Oriental thinking – world-thinking union.

Another visitor: In the Occident, if we think of God as a holiness, it is a good thinking?

Swamiji: It is the best thinking. It is not only good, but the best.

Visitor: In fact, to me there is no meaning in having one religion saying this is the right God, and another religion saying that is the right God.

Swamiji: Different religions say 'this God, that God'. It is not a proper thing. It can create conflict and wars, religious wars. That is not a good thing. And it cannot be called religion, also. It is a kind of phantasm.

Visitor: But the truth is that no one has ever seen God, has ever known exactly what God is. Maybe we are God ourselves.

Swamiji: God is the universally expanded form of your own mind; therefore, you can reach God. If you are completely cut off from God, how will you reach? The method of reaching God is in your heart. God is working through your heart, through your mind, and it is through that only you can reach God, not by argument, and all that. The inner and the outer should be brought together into a universal way of thinking. When the outer and the inner come together, the differences vanish. If all humanity joined together and think like one mind... We have got a political organisation called the United Nations. It is a symbol of united thinking of the whole world. But that is not sufficient. It must go beyond. Instead of many minds sitting together and having a conference, there is only one mind. All think one thought only. That is greater than the United Nations. But it is a good beginning.

Another visitor: When there is no difference between external things and internal things...

Swamiji: Then immediately it becomes universal, and then the whole thing vanishes. You will feel you are alone existing.

Visitor: So it's the best medicine.

Swamiji: The best medicine, and the only medicine. There is no other way. Finally, that is the only way.

Another visitor: After death what happens to you?

Swamiji: Why are you wanting death? Forget it. You should not think of death. It is negative thinking. If you go on thinking of death, you will get reborn. Another birth will come. If you say that death and birth are only some processes of evolution towards the highest experience, then it will not create any sorrow. Birth and death are evolutionary processes. It is necessary for everyone to evolve for the purpose of becoming the whole universe, God Himself. The purpose is to attain God Himself. That is the ultimate aim. Everybody, everything, moves towards that. That is evolution.